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2005/12/26, 04:58 PM
I have read that performing between 8-12 reps on any given weight lifting exercise "tones" the muscle rather than builds it. Toning muscles apparently tightens the muscle and gives the lifter a more "cut" look. I have also read, however, that toning is a myth and that you either build muscle or you don't. "There is no toning".
My question is: is there a way to train to tone muscles? And what exactly is the difference between tone and built?
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2005/12/26, 05:08 PM
no it doesn't....and I really wanna slap the person who invented that term...it's simply a mix of hypertrophy and muscle endurance training.....
toning is a term that is used to mean losing body fat or gaining muscle mass.....or both.....i can't believe some terms like this stick around for so long...even in some top gyms....
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2005/12/27, 06:39 PM
word does exsist but in another sense....its the term describing what a muscle looks like at rest
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Friends don't let friends squat high...
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2005/12/27, 06:48 PM
i think people misapply the term to mean 'lean' look.....
it has become a versatile word...sort of like F....you can use it as a noun, verb, adjective, etc....
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2005/12/27, 06:51 PM
toned look=bit of muscle mass and little bodyfat(lean)....often around 8-12% for guys...where sometimes their 6pack is not showing but they have flat stomach....*
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2005/12/28, 02:01 PM
tone is an adjective, not a verb. Whoever has helped spread it as a verb, indeed deserves a slap.
as for fcuk, have you heard the audio clip on that. It certainly illustrates the diversity of the word.
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Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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Quoting from 7707mutt:
The squat cage is holy ground.
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2005/12/29, 11:12 PM
To tighten muscle is to build muscle. By tightening your muscles, you're making it denser; to make it denser, you build muscle.
Most of the time, "toning" muscle means to build muscle density and burn fat to expose muscle. Eight to twelve reps seems like a moderate rep (I consider high rep to be 18-20), and most of the "toning bunnies" do low intensity, high rep. Once the body has adjusted to the intensity, its really nothing doing anything for the body, therefore you increase the intensity. When I do sets, I prefer to do eight reps on my last set (failure point before nine).
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2005/12/30, 05:44 PM
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Quoting from fighting_london:
To tighten muscle is to build muscle. By tightening your muscles, you're making it denser; to make it denser, you build muscle.
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Im trying to be nice when I ask what you are talking about?
Muscle density is built by training myofibrillated (sp?) hypertrophy as opposed to sarcoplasmic hypertrophy. Myofibrillated hypertrophy is denser in nature, as it is more fibrous and less water filled. This is why lightweight powerlifters, olympic lifters, gymnasts, etc, all appear to have a "harder" appearance than many bodybuilders, even though they lack the mass.
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Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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Quoting from 7707mutt:
The squat cage is holy ground.
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2005/12/30, 05:52 PM
Glad to have you on the board wrestler...I used to have to field all these type responses. Now I have you! :big_smile:
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Quoting from wrestler125:
Im trying to be nice when I ask what you are talking about?
Muscle density is built by training myofibrillated (sp?) hypertrophy as opposed to sarcoplasmic hypertrophy. Myofibrillated hypertrophy is denser in nature, as it is more fibrous and less water filled. This is why lightweight powerlifters, olympic lifters, gymnasts, etc, all appear to have a "harder" appearance than many bodybuilders, even though they lack the mass.
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If you don't stand for something, you will fall for anything....
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2005/12/30, 09:25 PM
One of the exercise programs on this site?
http://www.freetrainers.com/FT/jsp/ExerciseResources.jsp
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2005/12/30, 09:52 PM
thanks ron. I'm glad you guys find me helpful, because I started my quest for intelligent training on sites like this, learning from guys like you. I hope to be as helpful to some of the members, as trainers like you have been to me. FT is sort of a home for me, a way to give back.
2fingers, I pm'd you a response.
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Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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Quoting from 7707mutt:
The squat cage is holy ground.
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2005/12/30, 10:36 PM
While I am not as liberal with the big words as Ron and wrestler (lol kidding you guys rock!), I do know this, show me a person trying to gain lean muscle, and uses the so called "toning" method...please...I have never seen one person gain muscle by using that BS.
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Less Talk, More Chalk!
The Men and Boys are Separated by one thing: The Squat Cage!
7707mutt@freetrainers.com
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2005/12/31, 02:36 PM
well put AND easy to understand.
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2005/12/31, 04:18 PM
Message deleted by moderator due to unsuitable content for this board.
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2005/12/31, 04:25 PM
Posted in the wrong place....only way we have to edit or delete. :)
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If you don't stand for something, you will fall for anything....
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2005/12/31, 05:04 PM
"toning" started I think prolly by infomercials....."if you do this you can tone and burn fat"....which is horse crap.
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Friends don't let friends squat high...
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/01/01, 03:12 PM
Meh. I asked the same question to my brother and that's the response I got. Tightening muscle is making it denser, but to make it more dense, you have to build muscle, or so he explained to me.
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2006/01/02, 10:05 AM
nice response wrestler....
FL what does your brother do that makes him a good candidate to ask that question? there are plenty of trainers who are still living in the 70s or in the 'toning my midsection' age....
Hypertrophy
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
Jump to: navigation, search
Hypertrophy is the increase of the size of an organ. It should be distinguished from hyperplasia which occurs due to cell division; hypertrophy occurs due to an increase in cell size rather than division. It is most commonly seen in muscle that has been actively stimulated, the most well-known method being exercise.
Hypertrophy is only desirable when it occurs in the skeletal muscles. This is most effectively done by undertaking resistance training, though it can also occur during other high anaerobic exercises such as interval training, rowing, cycling and sprinting.
For hypertrophy to occur in the skeletal muscles, the muscle must be directly stimulated as discussed above. Also a diet in which there is a caloric surplus and abundant in protein is required in conjunction with regular rest (8-10 hours per night). Though protein is an integral part of attaining muscular hypertrophy, it should not be overdone as it can put the kidneys under increased stress as it has to process more urea. Also you should consult with your physician before undertaking any strenuous exercise routine.
Hypertrophy can be pathological in many organs; for example in the heart hypertrophy of the left ventricle can be associated with up to a four fold risk of dying over the following 5 years. In skeletal muscle, it is usually helpful and increases strength.
Two different types of hypertrophy are common; Sarcoplasmic hypertrophy, in which sarcoplasmic fluid in the muscle cell increases rather than the contractile protein, and hence no increase in contractile strength. Myofibrillated Hypertrophy, in which there is an increase in myofibrils, and hence increase in muscular contractile strength.
Resistance training
Resistance training typically produces a combination of the two different types of hypertrophy; contraction against 80-90% of the 1RM for lower number of repetitions causes myofibrillated hypertrophy to dominate (as in powerlifters, olympic lifters and strength athletes), while several repetitions against a sub-maximal load facilitates mainly sarcoplasmic hypertrophy (professional bodybuilders and endurance athletes).Ventricular hypertrophy (i.e., increased ventricular mass) is an adaptation by the ventricle to increased stress, such as chronically increased volume load (preload) or increased pressure load (afterload). It is a physiological response that enables the heart to adapt to increased stress; however, the response can become pathological and ultimately lead to a deterioration in function. For example, hypertrophy is a normal physiological adaptation to exercise training that enables the ventricle to enhance its pumping capacity. This type of physiologic hypertrophy is reversible and non-pathological. Chronic hypertension causes ventricular hypertrophy. This response enables the heart to maintain a normal stroke volume despite the increase in afterload. However, over time, pathological changes occur in the heart that lead to a functional degradation and heart failure.
If the precipitating stress is volume overload, the ventricle responds by adding new sarcomeres in-series with existing sarcomeres. This results in ventricular dilation while maintaining normal sarcomere lengths. The wall thickness normally increases in proportion to the increase in chamber radius. This type of hypertrophy is termed eccentric hypertrophy.
In the case of chronic pressure overload, the chamber radius may not change; however, the wall thickness greatly increases as new sarcomeres are added in-parallel to existing sarcomeres. This is termed concentric hypertrophy. This type of ventricle is capable of generating greater forces and higher pressures, while the increased wall thickness maintains normal wall stress. This type of ventricle becomes "stiff" (i.e., compliance is reduced) which can impair filling and lead to diastolic dysfunction.
from
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypertrophy
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2006/01/02, 11:28 AM
ok here goes...tone is a very versatile word...
tone: n.
1. Music
a. A sound of distinct pitch, quality, and duration; a note.
b. The interval of a major second in the diatonic scale; a whole step.
c. A recitational melody in a Gregorian chant.
2.
a. The quality or character of sound.
b. The characteristic quality or timbre of a particular instrument or voice.
3.
a. The pitch of a word used to determine its meaning or to distinguish differences in meaning.
b. The particular or relative pitch of a word, phrase, or sentence.
4. Manner of expression in speech or writing: took an angry tone with the reporters.
5. A general quality, effect, or atmosphere: a room with an elegant tone.
6.
a. A color or shade of color: light tones of blue.
b. Quality of color: The green wallpaper had a particularly somber tone.
7. The general effect in painting of light, color, and shade.
8. Physiology
a. The normal state of elastic tension or partial contraction in resting muscles.
b. Normal firmness of a tissue or an organ.
v. toned, ton·ing, tones
1. To give a particular tone or inflection to.
2. To soften or change the color of (a painting or photographic negative, for example).
3. To sound monotonously; intone.
4. To make firmer or stronger. Often used with up: exercises that tone up the body
1. To assume a particular color quality.
2. To harmonize in color.
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2006/01/02, 06:13 PM
I meant that I had asked him the same question before coming to FT. Before coming here, my brother, who is being trained by three personal trainers for Joe Gibbs racing team (NASCAR) for a jackman, was the only person I knew to go to with questions.
He's lost 30 pounds, changed his diet, works out 5 days a week, takes No-xplode (I think that's what it is. In a bright red container), Creatine, Whey protein shakes, lost 11% body fat.. all since August 2005.
He's a regular on bodybuilding.com and louisdorman.com . I thought he'd know something on the subject.
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2006/01/03, 06:58 PM
I know alot of people who lost weight....but i don't ask for advice...plus trainers don't teach....they just show you what to do...
You are either gaining muscle....or cutting fat....theres no middle area really. Any newbie starting out can "gain" muscle and drop fat like crazy....after the first 2-3 months....yoru either need to be building muscle....or maintaining and cutting fat....not much gray area..
and what no explode and creatine and whey have to do with toning?
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Friends don't let friends squat high...
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/01/03, 07:03 PM
I know alot of people who lost weight....but i don't ask for advice...plus trainers don't teach....they just show you what to do...
You are either gaining muscle....or cutting fat....theres no middle area really. Any newbie starting out can "gain" muscle and drop fat like crazy....after the first 2-3 months....yoru either need to be building muscle....or maintaining and cutting fat....not much gray area..
and what no explode and creatine and whey have to do with toning?
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Friends don't let friends squat high...
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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2006/01/03, 07:03 PM
Message deleted by moderator due to unsuitable content for this board.
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2006/01/03, 07:14 PM
I figured he'd know what he's doing as he's had great results. As far as mentioning what he's taking, it was to show that he's serious and committed, not just a gym bunny doing it for the fitness fad.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't building muscle cut fat if you've got some sort of calorie deficit?
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2006/01/03, 11:53 PM
Yea, because creatine and xplode show committment. Get back to me when he is in the gym with a broken arm/leg. Or when he can say he has trained for 3 years without missing a day. Or better yet, when he is up at 6:00am christmas morning in his basement because he knows he won't be able to get his workout in later.
Building muscle will help to burn more calories. However, it is very difficult to build muscle with a calorie deficit.
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Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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Quoting from 7707mutt:
The squat cage is holy ground.
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2006/01/03, 11:55 PM
Just reread my post, and I realized I came across a bit cynical. Sorry, but I just am not of the opinion that supplementation shows committment. Some of the most uncommitted lifters I know have the most impressive supplement cabinets. Almost all of the serious lifters I know take only a couple of supplements (whey and creatine) and a multi.
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Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.
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Quoting from 7707mutt:
The squat cage is holy ground.
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2006/01/04, 12:31 PM
if everyone ate less and worked out....US would be the healthiest nation....if you do that then YOu WILL see results its not magical.
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Friends don't let friends squat high...
People don't reach thier true potental, only those who seek it.
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