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Has Paul Chek finally lost it???

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wrestler125
wrestler125
Posts: 4,619
Joined: 2004/01/27
United States
2006/01/15, 10:01 PM
I like to stay on top of things, but I can't say I check his website every morning after I drink my tea. But has anyone checked out his website lately???
Is it just me, or is it starting to look even MORE like a cult? Check out his "mission statement". Wow.

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Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.

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Quoting from 7707mutt:
The squat cage is holy ground.
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wrestler125
wrestler125
Posts: 4,619
Joined: 2004/01/27
United States
2006/01/16, 04:25 PM
Barely a day after I post this, an article from t-nation comes out.

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do;jsessionid=40F324A4D7EDB046A955928F6D2BA9FA.hydra?id=885647

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Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.

============
Quoting from 7707mutt:
The squat cage is holy ground.
============
2006/01/16, 09:29 PM
So let me comment on some of his points:

"And the first thing they ask me every time is, "What drugs are you using?" I tell them chicken, carrots, broccoli, water, sleep, and a reason to be alive. I go into the gym and lift weights because it's a part of my spiritual practice; it's part of maintaining the temple. I don't need to go to church; I am the church."

-old saying, your body is your temple...your body will only take you as far as you allow it....

"• If you don't want to have problems, eat real food. Stop eating all this cheap crap. I've had multi-millionaires and world-class professional athletes in my office tell me that organic food is too expensive.

I walk them to the window and point to their $140,000 sports car and say, "Eat that fucker then! Because when you die they aren't going to bury that son of a bitch with you!"

It's just a matter of getting your priorities right. The more toxic your body is, the lower your quality of life is."

-excellent point we must set our priorities straight...materialism in itself is not wrong however when it begins to cloud one's judgement especially when it comes to one's health....no amount of money can buy an old person their youth and many would be willing to give away everything for just that....and often do in search of it...
(gotta love plastic surgeons)

"If you can't pronounce a word on the label, don't eat it."
-people new to fitness are often mislead by fancy sounding names....an apple is an apple, rye bread is rye bread...when there are a bunch of crazy sounding ingredients...it's time to go for something healthier....

"• The people who say that organic food is no better then regular are what's technically known as controlbots. A controlbot is somebody whose mind has been taken over by corporate entities or religion or anybody who has an agenda

• Scientific studies show that hands-down, bar none, not only is there far more nutrition in food raised organically, but there are detrimental effects to the consumption of any commercially raised food.

This isn't only because the commercially raised food carries the residues of the toxic chemicals within and on them, but the soil microorganisms that are responsible for generating the nutrition to feed the plant and provide much of the immune system of the plant are rapidly killed by the application of chemical fertilizers, pesticides, and herbicides

One of the things commercial farmers do is they put so much salt on the ground that the plants have to suck up huge amounts of water to neutralize the salt and survive. This makes for bigger, lovely looking produce, but in reality you get big empty corn cobs and big empty carrots.

One research study showed that today, to get the same nutrition from one head of lettuce as you did 50 years ago, you'd have to eat 20 heads of lettuce from the commercial farms."

-I think if Paul looks hard enough he'll recognize that he's a 'controlbot' in many areas as well....driven by his own agenda....however if organic food is an option, I would lean this way to avoid many chemicals used to raise produce...

" Anyone with two brain cells to rub together should be able to look at one picture of me and know that you can't do that with just a Swiss ball!

A Swiss ball is a very therapeutic and useful adjunct to add to any weight lifting program. It's a tool. I just happened to have popularized it. So people with sheep mentality immediately think that's all that I do.
"

-great point I think he's seen as a mad genius...but there's a method to his craziness....yes he uses it...but it's not everything....he was among first to use it...(not sure he invented or popularized it..)...so people overgeneralize this as the whole system of his training...


Although his comments have made his ideology sound like integration into a cult...I will say that health and healthy living is a process of immersion...so you can't do it half way....you have to embrace it...and that's his main point...beyond his mysticism and spirituality which he espouses....

Many of his theories have been shown misleading or wrong...however....the point is not to be perfect....the point is to contribute and I think among his eccentricity....there are many valuable things to learn from him...one just has to be smart enough to see through a lot of bs...he's not the fitness mesiah....so once that is grasped....everything else follows..
nellyboy
nellyboy
Posts: 209
Joined: 2004/07/09
United States
2006/01/21, 05:36 PM
Hey I know it's been awhile since I posted, but since you believe I'm a Chek fanatic, I figured I'd post on this topic.

First off wrestler, yeah I agree with you that he has kind of gone a different direction than everyone in world seems to be heading, but hey, that's his choice. Whatever flips your bill...I guess. Secondly, he's a TEACHER, not Budda! The Institutes curriculum is like any other, it's up for interpretation regarding its validity. You should see how I can rip apart our local College curriculum for this profession...but am I completely right? Who knows.

Menace, what theories have been "shown" to be misleading or wrong? You stated two paragraphs earlier that many over-generalize his theories, so if "his" theories aren't even completely understood or in most cases...read completely, then how can they be "shown" to be misleading or wrong?

What I find when I discuss any of these topics with fellow health practitioners, all they've read is the information listed on his websites!
nellyboy
nellyboy
Posts: 209
Joined: 2004/07/09
United States
2006/01/21, 06:50 PM
Another point I've wanted to make many times concerning being bashed for following theories from the Chek Institute or Charles Poliquin or Weston A Price is that: don't argue the person...ARGUE THE POINT! If you read up on propaganda, one of the first ways to spot it, is to see if they attack the person. This usually means that they cannot argue the points and therefore attempt to discredit the individual.
wrestler125
wrestler125
Posts: 4,619
Joined: 2004/01/27
United States
2006/01/21, 08:04 PM
sorry man, but his website looks like a cult. I have read a lot of his articles, and I do agree that most people tend to take him the wrong way and misunderstand where he is coming from. That is why I still continue to visit his website from time to time. But have you seen it lately? Is he starting a cult or something. Problem is, I don't disagree with a lot of his points, just that he takes them too far. I argue with anyone that believes in such extremes.

--------------
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.

============
Quoting from 7707mutt:
The squat cage is holy ground.
============
nellyboy
nellyboy
Posts: 209
Joined: 2004/07/09
United States
2006/01/21, 11:07 PM
Have I seen it lately? I am a Chek Student, so of course I have. The issue you're having is with his spiritual ideology, which I personally do NOT agree with. I am a psuedo-Baptist and all that information that's on that particular subject is not for me. This does not mean that I think he's starting a cult, he just believes in something different than I and many others do. He also states...clearly...that this is not something Chek students are required to learn or buy into.

Now, what extremes are you talking about? Nutrition? Motor Re-Conditioning? Strength and Conditioning? ect.
wrestler125
wrestler125
Posts: 4,619
Joined: 2004/01/27
United States
2006/01/22, 12:26 AM
He takes a lot of stuff too far. Nutrition (I want to see his proof that he mentions that others say doesn't exist), organic eating, motor re-conditioning, toxins, etc. I remember chek when it first came out, it was good stuff. A friend posted on a board and put it well: "I think he gives far too little credit to the basics that he practices that has kept himself in shape and gives far too much credit to the mysticism."

It is this mysticism that had people walking out on him at the SWIS symposium.

Of course you're a chek student. It's easy to follow when you pay thousands of dollars to do so. I know trainers that have spent thousands of dollars to become "Chek Interns" that now regret it and think he is full of BS. Not trying to take a cheap shot, but this is a reality.

I prefer to follow no one particular teacher. Instead, I prefer to learn from all of them. If you were to ask me who influenced what I know, I could give you a list 2 pages long. Cosgrove, DeFranco, Waterbury, Ballantyne, Tate, Wendler, Simmons, Cressey, Robertson, Tsatsouline, Furey, Ferruggia, Berardi, Fry, King, Poliquin, Rooney, Jim Smith, James Smith, Murphy, Shugart, Even-Esh and even Chek all of the top of my head. Follow no one blindly. Chek may claim to be able to smell when his athletes are eating poorly, but I can always follow a Chek follower.


Look, I of all people that Chek is capable of making some excellent points that some people tend to get a little bit to far off of. At the Swis symposium, he made a point about when one of his athletes told him eating healthy was too expensive, he walked to the window, and told him to eat his (expetive deleted) sports car. This is something todays athletes need to pay attention to. Similarly, he can push jerk a 185lb man, and from what I hear he deadlifts 400+.

"Anyone with two brain cells to rub together should be able to look at one picture of me and know that you can't do that with just a Swiss ball!" I think if he concentrated on the basics that he used to achieve this, and less on playing the mystic, then people wouldnt react so harshly to him.


Off topic, but I have successfully returned to drinking milk with no problems, after having given it up for almost 10 weeks. Only thing I can say is that I have changed to skim, as that way it follows a P+C meal.

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Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.

============
Quoting from 7707mutt:
The squat cage is holy ground.
============
wrestler125
wrestler125
Posts: 4,619
Joined: 2004/01/27
United States
2006/01/22, 11:24 PM
He claims organic is more pro performance. I have seen studies that have shown that while nutritional content may be higher, it is no easier on the digestive track.

I'm going to have to ask you to be a little more objective. You are attacking members of that board as "idiots", saying they are brainwashed, and attacking them saying they can not form sentences, and then YOU talk about propaganda. Re-read your post, I am sure you will realize how you come across there.

You comment that guys are talking about how people live longer today than they did in the 1900's. While this is incorrect thinking, this is Chek's line of thinking.

Now, you comment on the intelligence of some of the t-nation posters. It has been my experiance that many of them show a better understanding of the concepts that MATTER than many other individuals. However, I know at least 4 people that were full fledged Chek followers that now disagree with a lot of what he says. Not to mention all the people I have read talking about the same thing.

I think we agree on more than you realize. Chek advocates weight lifting as the best form of activity, and he knows his kinesiology on spot. He is one of the best in his field (rehabilitive kinesiology) in the world, I do not argue with this. I believe him when he says that it takes more than a balance board to push press a 235lb man. He didn't develop this through what he promotes, he developed it through his hardcore approach to strength training.

I could compare chek to Dave Tate. There are those that would follow tate blindly. Tate knows how to develop strength second to few. But I will readily argue when I disagree with him (which is about half of what he says not regarding strength development). I think you need to learn to be more discriminatory with what you choose to believe. I may be called a tate follower, as I was early on influenced by him and the westside crew, but there are interviews that I hear him in that I am like, wtf?

I think you need to learn to be more discriminatory with what you choose to believe, and be a little more objective in your thinking.
Question everything nelly. I don't care who says it.

--------------
Pain is only temporary, it is in your mind. If you can still walk, then you can still run.

============
Quoting from 7707mutt:
The squat cage is holy ground.
============
2006/01/23, 12:15 AM
Generally speaking T-nation posters are quite a bit smarter than members of most other boards I have run across....also just because they make spelling mistakes....(as we all do) that doesn't take away from their arguments....you attacked each of those members without exactly showing how they are wrong....the guy who explained why Chek was way off about bacteria knew what he was talking about....Chek sounded rediculous when he says stuff that he did....and reread what you wrote....instead of disproving those posters, you simply attacked them as idiots...you even admitted that you didn't understand what one of the guys was writing but only that he corrected himself....so what?....many of them made great points.....

Chek spouts a bunch of crazy concepts .....with little scientific support for it....sorry but in this day and age you do need it......double blind studies ...etc...yes some may have flaws in them that make them inapplicable but nevertheless they are the best thing to prove something as worthwhile or worthless....

Also pesticides are often not as big of a problem as it is made out to be....only some plants are significantly affected by it...there are plenty of vegetation that has been found to have only minute amounts of pesticides on them and no real need to buy organic foods instead ....

Chek is definitely no fool in many areas...but blindly following every damn thing he says is a joke....no one is 100% right...and to think so is outright rediculous....I think part of his 'schtick' ise just to attract attention on to himself...good or bad....

::::goes to measure his feces...::::::
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